I messed up ... question about consequences

[Naomi]

hi guys - I've screwed up and just need to share and get your input (I don't expect much sympathy from the ERs on here but hopefully more from the EEs). I had an appointment (as he calls them) with my ER on Saturday night - it would have been the first time I'd been punished for at least a month. I spent the afternoon out with some girlfriends in Hoxton, we drank quite a bit and I ended up not going back to my place for the time he was due round. After a few spritzers I was having fun and I'd decided that I didn't fancy getting spanked and wanted to stay out with the girls. So I just went for dinner and ignored our appointment and Jay's calls (I guess because I wasn't keen on picking up the phone to a scolding) - he had actually gone to my place as scheduled but obviously couldn't get in. I messaged him on Sunday morning and tried to minimise it saying I'd had a diary clash (that may not have been a smart message to send). He's pretty furious with me. I feel bad, obviously. He has asked me what I think the consequences should be (I hate those questions) and told me to ask what my friends on my forum (here) what would happen if they had done this or if their EE did this. He's made me do this before when I broke an implement - anyway, I promised I would ask. Be kind because last time he followed some of the suggestions you guys made! ;( N

[Spank_that_ass]

2 hours ago, Naomi said:

hi guys - I've screwed up and just need to share and get your input (I don't expect much sympathy from the ERs on here but hopefully more from the EEs). I had an appointment (as he calls them) with my ER on Saturday night - it would have been the first time I'd been punished for at least a month. I spent the afternoon out with some girlfriends in Hoxton, we drank quite a bit and I ended up not going back to my place for the time he was due round. After a few spritzers I was having fun and I'd decided that I didn't fancy getting spanked and wanted to stay out with the girls. So I just went for dinner and ignored our appointment and Jay's calls (I guess because I wasn't keen on picking up the phone to a scolding) - he had actually gone to my place as scheduled but obviously couldn't get in. I messaged him on Sunday morning and tried to minimise it saying I'd had a diary clash (that may not have been a smart message to send). He's pretty furious with me. I feel bad, obviously. He has asked me what I think the consequences should be (I hate those questions) and told me to ask what my friends on my forum (here) what would happen if they had done this or if their EE did this. He's made me do this before when I broke an implement - anyway, I promised I would ask. Be kind because last time he followed some of the suggestions you guys made! ;( N

I am thinking that you may not get much sympathy from the EE here either.  I think you need to choose the implement you like least and offer to take and extra session with it after what you would have gotten on Saturday.

[Slipperslipper]

The decision not to get involved in a session once under the influence of alcohol was actually a very sensible one, however the decision to start drinking alcohol when you knew you had an appointment was not very sensible or considerate.

In my personal experience breaking the rules on alcohol consumption or sensible guidelines on alcohol consumption has invariable resulted in being caned and I've found as an adult most disciplinarians consider 12 the minimum for a single or first offence.

For failing to keep the appointment, obviously the original punishment plus extra for not reporting when told to do so. That will depend on how annoyed you ER is and exactly what inconvenience you put them to. I suspect you are going to be in for a proper disciplinary punishment rather than "a bit of fun"!

[Dominator994]

You should receive a double dose of spankings after missing your appointment with him

[Overigo]

I think it depends on how much you actually respect your ER. If you are at the point where its not really working then I think you should be honest with your self and with them. If however it was a one off lapse, I think you need to own up to the fact and deal with the consequences. I doubt very much you would get a warm up spanking. A good dose of the cane or other such implement would go someway to making amends. It is going to hurt and you put yourself in that position, so good luck and just think, your ER is doing it for your benefit!

Please let us know how you get on....

[Explorify]

Because I agree with the thought that the consumption of alcohol prior to a scheduled session shows unacceptably poor judgment, I would add that one outcome of this session should be a hard-and-fast rule that this does not happen again. -Ex.

[Chawsee]

I don't know if this is another "fantasy," trying to be passed off in the General Spanking Discussion Forum as a truthful story (we've been bombarded with those lately 🙄), or if this is an honest and sincere question. I'm going to treat it as an honest and sincere question and assume that you genuinely do want others' opinions:

You didn't state how far your disciplinarian has to commute to reach your place, but it's a given that he planned his evening around this, around helping you. So if you're off getting drunk, ignoring his phone calls, and deciding to "stay out with the girls," instead of being where you agreed to be at that time, you are blatantly disrespecting him and the agreement you made with him. And, you are showing him (and anyone else that you do this kind of thing to) that you can't be trusted to keep your word. Only you can decide if that's the reputation that you want for yourself.

It's one thing to express to a disciplinarian that you need help and guidance in certain areas of your life. Guiding and supporting you is what he wants to do. But a disciplinarian also needs to see effort on your part. When your behavior is immature and inconsiderate, and you're leaving him in the lurch, don't be surprised if he grows weary of this and eventually moves on someone more sincere and dedicated.

[danadares]

I think I see what this might be about. Forgive me if I'm off base here. Some of us who are attracted to the disciplinary side of spanking are looking for a certain level of drama. Punishment is no mundane set of circumstances. Someone has been a very "bad girl" (or "boy"), they have truly earned the dire position they are in, and the consequences must therefore be elevated to match the transgression, or possibly multiple acts of totally unacceptable behavior. I am assuming here, because the ER is asking for suggestions, that the partners in this drama are on the same page. The ER has agreed to this, where it is a given that misbehavior can be so blatantly irresponsible, careless and disrespectful. In order to set the table for events like this, the ER wants to be in a relationship where their EE willfully ignores basic courtesy and consideration so that the drama can be realized. It could be that, if the ER is running out of ideas, outside suggestions are useful.

From my perspective, I can't be much help. I've never been in a relationship like this, I have no list of interesting punishments to try, and I have to know someone and be involved with them to understand what is appropriate or not. I'll just say that the very bad behavior should be addressed and, even if the situation has been foreseen or somewhat contrived, punishment is justified.

[Bramblewine]

17 hours ago, Chawsee said:

I don't know if this is another "fantasy," trying to be passed off in the General Spanking Discussion Forum as a truthful story (we've been bombarded with those lately 🙄), or if this is an honest and sincere question. I'm going to treat it as an honest and sincere question and assume that you genuinely do want others' opinions:

 

Knowing @Naomi, this is an honest and sincere question. Search her posts and you'll see. She's not one to post fantasies, let alone pass them off as reality.

Edited September 28, 2022 by Bramblewine
typo

[Bramblewine]

As for the original question... I'm not in this kind of dynamic and have no interest in it, personally, so I can't speak from experience... but it seems logical to me that the original punishment plus something extra would be the way to go. What the something extra is, depends. It should be within your limit, of course. Perhaps outside your perceived limits, but not outside your actual limits. 

That might mean an additional session, if you can't take it all in one go. Or not, if you can.

As I recall, you have a last resort implement, don't you? If that last resort implement wasn't going to be used on you had you kept the original appointment, maybe adding that would be punishment enough. Or something lighter and then the last resort implement, on top of what you were already going to get.

[Naomi]

Hi guys, I feel I probably need to respond to some of this. First up "thanks" for the thoughts and suggestions. And Bramblewine thanks for being supportive, it's appreciated.

 

I haven't yet been able to see Jay due us both being busy with work - I may be going over tonight. As much as I'm not looking forward to it I also find it frustrating because for me as an EE it's more effective when punishment and accountability follows pretty quickly. But I guess that delays are inevitable when the disciplinary arrangement is with someone who you don't live with.

 

Given what Chawsee and Danadares have said (which I was disappointed to read) I should probably give some context to asking this question. Since I started on this journey I have basically had no one I know to discuss my thoughts and feelings about spanking/discipline etc other than my friend Jay who has for most of this period been my ER. As some of you know I worked with another ER temporarily but she wasn't someone with whom I could share lots of feelings and thoughts - she's a no sense disciplinarian. Loads of you know that leaping into the spanking world without that network and without being able to talk to friends about it is challenging - there is so much I didn't know and still don't know but perhaps the hardest thing has been trying to understand my own feelings about being a woman who gets spanked - e.g., why I need it, whether I am vanilla, whether there's an unacknowledged sexual element for me, how I reconcile being a strong feminist with having a male friend give me corporal punishment etc. So I have found this forum and many of the people here incredibly helpful - it's basically my main source of information and my main sounding board about all this stuff. As well as I know Jay, I needed and I still need somewhere to have discussions about this with people who are not my ER - there has always been an imbalance because he has experience in this world and I didn't. Sometimes when he and I talk about different aspects of my discipline, punishments, implements, positions, whether he's being too strict with me etc I mention ideas or thoughts I've picked up on here -- I think that probably annoys him a bit because he often thinks he knows what's best. That is probably why a few times when I've screwed up he's said things like - "why don't you ask your friends on your forum what would happen to them if they did this", sometimes that's been when he's put the ball in my court and asked me what I think should happen to me, I struggle to tell him and he'll then say eg get your friends on the forum to give you some ideas. That is basically what happened here when we exchanged messages on Sunday night; I was not wanting to acknowledge or give suggestions about what I deserved/needed or what would settle the scores. I think he means it half it semi flippantly (obviously he will decide how to handle this, within our agreed parameters) but I said I would ask and he will expect me to come to his place with suggestions on what should be done to me; when I did this once before, I obviously passed on the sympathetic suggestions as well as the mean ideas from (mainly) you ERs! I think Jay probably hopes that by asking the question I will also realise how wrong I've been (or it will reinforce that) and maybe he hopes that suggestions will be given of punishments that support his view that I've done something that requires a more serious punishment.

 

What happened on Saturday afternoon/evening was obviously terrible decision making by me but it's hardly dramatic or fantastical. Like many EEs (I assume) I don't look forward to punishments, I may know that I deserve them but that doesn't mean that I don't want to get out of them. And in some moods my submissiveness and my understanding that I truly benefit from discipline and accountability evaporates and I don't feel like going through the painful and humbling experience of getting a walloping. Saturday afternoon was one of those moments. That was fuelled by drinking and having a good time but it was obviously really irresponsible and disrespectful towards Jay. One of my problems - and I guess one of the reasons why spanking helps me - is that I can be really bad about thinking about the consequences of my actions ahead of time. I think that many of you who have been spanked / get spanked can probably see how what I did on Saturday could happen!

 

Chawsee - I don't know whether you are suggesting that I am lying or making up fantasy stories. I haven't read everything on this part of the forum recently and obviously have no idea if other people have done that. I'll assume that you're not accusing me of that (I've never previously understood you to suggest that about me and I enjoy your contributions to the discussions here, including mine). But I will say that I don't understand what I've said that seems untruthful or even exaggerated. I'm sure some of you think that it's pretty weird to have a disciplinary arrangement with a longstanding friend, without a sexual element and without acknowledging that there is any explicit sexual motivation for spanking from my side. I understand that. Although I am not sure that having this dynamic with someone I know (who is not my sexual partner) is much different to a woman in my position using a professional disciplinarian (and that's kind of what I did, without paying, for some of this year). I would rather that it was not with a friend because it has changed our friendship but as you guys know it is incredibly hard to find anyone to talk to about this stuff, let alone anyone who will discipline you and who you would trust to place yourself in a really vulnerable place with. Anyway, I don't see how any of that makes me a fantasist.

 

Dandares - I can kind of understand why you might think that but I don't think our dynamic does involve drama or any role play whatsoever. Actually I don't really get the role play side of spanking that some people obviously enjoy - I can't see how that works within a genuine, asexual disciplinary arrangement. Hopefully the above explains why Jay suggested this and also why I got into this position. It is definitely not a given that I can act in that way - he was and I think remains really angry but also very upset with me. I haven't done this before, the closest thing might have been breaking an implement after a spanking (to be fair, I had a PMT).

 

Bramblewine - you've a good memory. We do have a last resort implement (it's a delrin, tear-jerker thingy) -  we had agreed that it would likely only ever be used for dishonesty/lying. I've only had it a couple of times and he definitely hasn't done anything more than used it pretty lightly but I would say it's worst thing he's ever used on me (I've had worse from the female ER I worked with) and I dread it. But I think Jay may feel that it's warranted for this - if that's right we'd have a chat about it.

 

Nay

[rubyredd]

There are so many different things to think about - and I have been considering what I would have expected in this situation. I have never been a particularly sympathetic spankee - even though I can empathize with every single thing you did. Keep in mind that I don't know your limits or what punishments you won't allow - and that I haven't been in a disciplinary dynamic for a while.

1. You missed the initial appointment and didn't call or answer his calls - knowing you would be lectured. Totally understand that desire, but it was really unfair to him. My expectation / suggestion would be some type of grounding. Nothing wrong with wanting to hang out with friends, but you bailed on an obligation. 

2. You lied about why you missed the appointment. To me, this misbehavior is why you need an additional spanking. It is confession time - you need to talk to him and explain what really happened. I would expect lines or an essay. 

So here is what I would expect as a (very well-behaved) spankee...

• Confession and discussion / lecture.

• The initial spanking you were supposed to get, but more intense now. 

• Writing lines or an essay immediately after the spanking. 

• More discussion and the additional spanking. I would prefer - if I were in your shoes - for this to be a set number of swats (e.g., 10 with a school paddle), but that is Top's choice.

• Follow-up discussion. Grounded for 1-2 weeks. 

You can always message me to chat about it more. I can't really be too detailed because I don't know exactly what is reasonable for you. But you will have to be willing to openly discuss this with your partner - and even ask for it.

**The empathetic spankee in me hopes you had fun with your friends, though. Please forgive any typos.

[Handily]

Well, at least we can thank Jay for getting you back among us. Some of your fans were unhappy not to see a blog account of your subsequent visit(s) to Victoria and your reunion with Jay.  Maybe he should as part of you next session insist that "you share with your forum friends exactly what the consequences of this misbehavior were."

                                 H.

[danadares]

Naomi: I don't know you, and I'm just responding to your post here. That was just my theory of the situation. I must have a theory, or would have no way to try to answer the question posed.

What I described is a relationship dynamic I know from people I've talked to, and what I've imagined. I don't see it as role play, and people do look for drama in real life, especially in the adult discipline arena. That doesn't mean the drama isn't real, or serious, or meaningful. In any case, it is dramatic that one misbehaves badly and must be punished accordingly. But, as long as both partners in this relationship are consenting, and it works for them, I see it as a good thing. So I was not being critical of what I imagined your relationship to be or why you do what you do. If this is not normal behavior for you, and I admit that, to me, fwiw, it sounded like you were being a bit too cavalier about it, then my theory is less compelling. It still appears you willfully screwed over your friend, and considering that he's your disciplinarian, it was just asking for trouble, i.e. drama.

So this is Jay's problem, and I would not presume to tell him how it should be handled. If it is your first such offense, and something you truly regret, then I would want to get to the punishment and the forgiveness in a way that works best for you. The way it works for me, and I'm assuming for Jay, I don't spank (punish) in anger or for revenge. Spanking is supposed to be a positive thing for the one being disciplined. Whatever the case, I wish you the best.

 

[spnkswtch]

I agree with most of the posts to-date.

Alcohol should never be in play for either the "er" or "ee".  I know from experience once and only once.  I'll never make that mistake again.  I was good to postpone it.

That said, I'm sure that the both of you have a pretty good idea what needs to happen.

[Newredbottom]

One of the questions I would ask, what is in this for you other than a sore bottom?  

[MrBottoms]

In quite plain 'n simple terms, "this little incident will Not happen again, I can assure you"

[Chawsee]

On 9/28/2022 at 4:40 PM, Bramblewine said:

Knowing @Naomi, this is an honest and sincere question. Search her posts and you'll see. She's not one to post fantasies, let alone pass them off as reality.

Thanks, Bramblewine. I did search some of her posts, but couldn't decipher this info adequately. So your vouch for her honesty and sincerity is appreciated. 

[Chawsee]

On 9/29/2022 at 2:57 AM, Naomi said:

Hi guys, I feel I probably need to respond to some of this. First up "thanks" for the thoughts and suggestions. And Bramblewine thanks for being supportive, it's appreciated.

 

I haven't yet been able to see Jay due us both being busy with work - I may be going over tonight. As much as I'm not looking forward to it I also find it frustrating because for me as an EE it's more effective when punishment and accountability follows pretty quickly. But I guess that delays are inevitable when the disciplinary arrangement is with someone who you don't live with.

 

Given what Chawsee and Danadares have said (which I was disappointed to read) I should probably give some context to asking this question. Since I started on this journey I have basically had no one I know to discuss my thoughts and feelings about spanking/discipline etc other than my friend Jay who has for most of this period been my ER. As some of you know I worked with another ER temporarily but she wasn't someone with whom I could share lots of feelings and thoughts - she's a no sense disciplinarian. Loads of you know that leaping into the spanking world without that network and without being able to talk to friends about it is challenging - there is so much I didn't know and still don't know but perhaps the hardest thing has been trying to understand my own feelings about being a woman who gets spanked - e.g., why I need it, whether I am vanilla, whether there's an unacknowledged sexual element for me, how I reconcile being a strong feminist with having a male friend give me corporal punishment etc. So I have found this forum and many of the people here incredibly helpful - it's basically my main source of information and my main sounding board about all this stuff. As well as I know Jay, I needed and I still need somewhere to have discussions about this with people who are not my ER - there has always been an imbalance because he has experience in this world and I didn't. Sometimes when he and I talk about different aspects of my discipline, punishments, implements, positions, whether he's being too strict with me etc I mention ideas or thoughts I've picked up on here -- I think that probably annoys him a bit because he often thinks he knows what's best. That is probably why a few times when I've screwed up he's said things like - "why don't you ask your friends on your forum what would happen to them if they did this", sometimes that's been when he's put the ball in my court and asked me what I think should happen to me, I struggle to tell him and he'll then say eg get your friends on the forum to give you some ideas. That is basically what happened here when we exchanged messages on Sunday night; I was not wanting to acknowledge or give suggestions about what I deserved/needed or what would settle the scores. I think he means it half it semi flippantly (obviously he will decide how to handle this, within our agreed parameters) but I said I would ask and he will expect me to come to his place with suggestions on what should be done to me; when I did this once before, I obviously passed on the sympathetic suggestions as well as the mean ideas from (mainly) you ERs! I think Jay probably hopes that by asking the question I will also realise how wrong I've been (or it will reinforce that) and maybe he hopes that suggestions will be given of punishments that support his view that I've done something that requires a more serious punishment.

 

What happened on Saturday afternoon/evening was obviously terrible decision making by me but it's hardly dramatic or fantastical. Like many EEs (I assume) I don't look forward to punishments, I may know that I deserve them but that doesn't mean that I don't want to get out of them. And in some moods my submissiveness and my understanding that I truly benefit from discipline and accountability evaporates and I don't feel like going through the painful and humbling experience of getting a walloping. Saturday afternoon was one of those moments. That was fuelled by drinking and having a good time but it was obviously really irresponsible and disrespectful towards Jay. One of my problems - and I guess one of the reasons why spanking helps me - is that I can be really bad about thinking about the consequences of my actions ahead of time. I think that many of you who have been spanked / get spanked can probably see how what I did on Saturday could happen!

 

Chawsee - I don't know whether you are suggesting that I am lying or making up fantasy stories. I haven't read everything on this part of the forum recently and obviously have no idea if other people have done that. I'll assume that you're not accusing me of that (I've never previously understood you to suggest that about me and I enjoy your contributions to the discussions here, including mine). But I will say that I don't understand what I've said that seems untruthful or even exaggerated. I'm sure some of you think that it's pretty weird to have a disciplinary arrangement with a longstanding friend, without a sexual element and without acknowledging that there is any explicit sexual motivation for spanking from my side. I understand that. Although I am not sure that having this dynamic with someone I know (who is not my sexual partner) is much different to a woman in my position using a professional disciplinarian (and that's kind of what I did, without paying, for some of this year). I would rather that it was not with a friend because it has changed our friendship but as you guys know it is incredibly hard to find anyone to talk to about this stuff, let alone anyone who will discipline you and who you would trust to place yourself in a really vulnerable place with. Anyway, I don't see how any of that makes me a fantasist.

 

Dandares - I can kind of understand why you might think that but I don't think our dynamic does involve drama or any role play whatsoever. Actually I don't really get the role play side of spanking that some people obviously enjoy - I can't see how that works within a genuine, asexual disciplinary arrangement. Hopefully the above explains why Jay suggested this and also why I got into this position. It is definitely not a given that I can act in that way - he was and I think remains really angry but also very upset with me. I haven't done this before, the closest thing might have been breaking an implement after a spanking (to be fair, I had a PMT).

 

Bramblewine - you've a good memory. We do have a last resort implement (it's a delrin, tear-jerker thingy) -  we had agreed that it would likely only ever be used for dishonesty/lying. I've only had it a couple of times and he definitely hasn't done anything more than used it pretty lightly but I would say it's worst thing he's ever used on me (I've had worse from the female ER I worked with) and I dread it. But I think Jay may feel that it's warranted for this - if that's right we'd have a chat about it.

 

Nay

Sorry to have left you hanging, Naomi. I've had a busy week and haven't checked in for a few days, so I just now caught up on this discussion thread. I can appreciate your story better now that you've explained a little more about where you're coming from. And the sincerity of the inner battle you described is worthy of understanding and empathy. I think a lot of us can relate to questioning ourselves and struggling to figure out, and accept, why we're like this.

To clarify, I was not accusing you of dishonesty. But I was wondering if we were in that territory-- hence my questioning comment, and my declaration that I would assume you were being honest and answer as such. If you've been scrolling through the General Spanking Discussion Forum lately, you will have seen that we've been bombarded with "bratting" posts, each claiming, "I did such-and-such (some immature or outrageous thing). How would you punish me?" And not just one such post, but numerous. Sometimes to the point of ad nauseam. 

So when I read your description of getting drunk, staying out with the girls, avoiding your ER's phone calls, etc., I was thinking, Is this another one?!  For the sake of your (good) reputation, and fellow members who get disheartened when we see the quality of SN's posts deteriorate from too many "junk" threads taking over, we thank you! And I do apologize for leaving you feeling like I didn't trust your honesty. You didn't deserve that.

All that said, my scolding about what you did stands. When you post a question like that here, you're not always going to like the replies you get. Chuckling, but true. And what I said to you is right along the line of the scolding that one of my own EEs would get in a similar scenario. Actually, what he would get would be a whole lot worse! 🤨

[Naomi]

Thanks for responding Chawsee - appreciated. Apologies accepted and sorry if I misread/misunderstood what you were saying.

And RubyRed thank you for your advice (which I took on board and discussed with my ER) and the offer to discuss it with me.

I finally saw Jay last night. I promise I will give a proper update soon (we talked about some of the above). In short: unsurprisingly he taught me a hell of a (deserved) lesson - he spanked me last night and again this morning (I stayed over in his spare room). I'm really sore and emotionally tired but fine. It was very cathartic and guilt-relieving for me; I think the slate is clean and Jay and I are fine.

Appreciate your guys' input.

[Naomi]

So I wrote a post about this in the blogs for anyone who is interested.

[Cowboy_Spanks30]

Very disrespectful and should come with a very high cost. You were not just naughty but made a choice to blow him off and not letting him know. You can also lose trust you’ve built up to this point. I hope you get this all worked out but I wouldn’t repeat it.