Blog Comments posted by Somthingrandom
@Tony Conrad not sure what you are replying to. I think the previous poster was just responding to the blog post not your comments. Clarify if you wish.
I will comment in a couple differant ways.
1. I am of the opinion anytime you are figuringing anything out it is ok and sometimes required to talk your religious or philosophical beliefs. All three major religions in the world espouse the belief that religion should permeate every area of your life. The humanist movements perspective of religion has a place and the rest of life (human) another place is not consitant with any religious belief I am aware of.
2. To figure out if CDD is permitted in Christianity you have to define it. Much CDD you find is the male partner dominating over the female partner using the verse "wives submit to your husband". As in the blog I will only deal with married couples.
If the wife is being forced or coerced by this verse then it is not Christian. Submission comes voluntarily from the submitter not forced. I suspect for many this is an excuse for the male partner to oppress his spouse.
However, if the submitter voluntarily and without pressure submits for the purpose of growing in holiness that I believe it could be Christian, but you would have to take a more Catholic or Eastern view of salvation and not protestant (PM me of you require a deeper explanation of this statement).
The general idea is "yes God saves your eternal soul but you are still responsible for your temporal mess and you should work on it with His help". If using DD helps you to grow and clean up your mess while growing in holiness then yes it would be permitted. Just like fasting or other forms of mortification (mortification of the flesh is a lost art that all three major religions allow - western culture has dropped it slowly since the renaissance since we are now "enlightened" - a point I take issue with).
If CDD is defined this way then a scriptural and traditional arguement can be made (for both spouses for those that have F/M DD). If CDD is the man oppressing thier wife then no and IMO a very serious issue.
3. Reading the story about your mom and how it had an effect on you I am at a loss for words. I can only say that thier is a place for you to come home to. The explanation provided by the priest irked me some as it is not quit correct and in an attempt to comfort you made it worse. CS Lewis in his dialog regarding life and death discussed how we all will die but that was not God's plan. Christiany does not see death as an end but the next step. God did not take your mother but did accept her with open arms at that time (it sounds like she was a believer). Death took your mother and will some day take all of us. Is it unfair? Yes, all life is precious regardless of circumstances surrounding death! However, God has done (Jesus) and is trying to be with us as history plays out so we have hope.
Anyway I will stop now. Feel free to PM me if you want to go more in depth or want somebody to talk to.
Sounds like you gave it a good try and it is disappointing. Some people dont come around.
To give you some hope my wife is finally initiating after knowing for 13 years and spanking for 2 to 3 now. Took her a long time.
It is your call but I know for me if she was still willing to do it if you ask I would at least accept that as a consolation prize. But that just my opinion.
Good luck and all the best to you.
I find both of your posts interesting.
One comment both of you made about not finding dedicated couples is probably a normal "selection bias" of these websites. Committed couples who have it working dont hang out too much on sites for people trying to find themselves. They are out there, just dont have as much need to talk about it on the internet.
Every couple will be differant. The advice I gave was trying to be general for people who have not taken that first step. Once the conversation has started then it depends on those involved.
Best of luck in your marriages moving forward on this.
@Tony Conrad I will disagree that spanking is sex or a sexual act. Alot of spanking has took place for many years outside of marriage...in fact most spanking has been in prisons, schools, and homes in situations not between spouses.
So while some incorporate it into the sexual act, it in of itself is not. I think you could ask questions of nudity and intimate interactions being proper. But is being nude to a doctor not proper? Is a massage improper (a real one...not a shady one)? My chiropractor touched and contorted my 500 differant ways today...all nonsexually.
I think extreme caution and deliberation should be taken to discern your motives. If they are sexual...then yes, wife only. If they are not I think you can argue that with proper precautions it is not much differant than a therapist or a massage logically.
@Tony Conrad On a separate note if you would like to PM me to discuss the Protestant/Catholic/Faith/Works discussion I would be open to it but not in a public forum. But one statement you made I would like to challenge you on. You said "we can show our faith by our works". If you read the passage and the whole book of James it is not "can" he says but you will show your faith by your works otherwise the faith is dead or in some translations missing. James is not faith with optional works it is faith and works must accompany each other. That is why I hate the debate are you saved by faith or by works....the proper response is "I am saved by grace which is made evident by my faith and works" because they accompany each other.
@Tony Conrad So the article did not cover nor was intended to cover some of the aspects you bring up. The discuss stemmed from several forum discussions on using Christianity to justify various DD aspects. The article was meant to point out that if you call it Christian this is the only argument I can find....otherwise it is DD you are trying to back into Christianity in some way. Which I am not sure is needed. I don't think a husband and wife spanking each other consensually is inherently sinful. But we have a lot of neo-puritans out there who take some confusion or "guilt" and try to remake their faith to fit the lifestyle they want and brand it "Christian" (essentially remaking God, because a fundamental premise if you believe in God is all things flow from him and are absolute. So you try to change God to fit what you want.). This was just an attempt to survey the different Christian doctrines and build up from them and not back into them. However, why not just make spanking a spanking. Between spouses why do we have to call it Christian is the bigger point. Do you have "Christian Dinner", "Christian Walks", "Christian Hand Holding"? Now an argument could be made to incorporate it into everything and my post would be relevant...but I am not sure you need to within the context of your marriage....sometimes a spanking is just a spanking.
@Tony ConradThe psychology behind the punishment aspect is tough to understand if you don't experience it. Not even sure most understand all of it. I do know several people who are sex only spankers and the punishment aspect is not there for them. That is fine too. The really weird ones like me are the ones so confused we can actually like and dislike it, with or with or without sex. But I have never claimed to be normal.
@Tony Conrad Thank you for the compliment. Sometimes our spouses surprise us, but either way they deserve to be in the conversation and make their own choice. It took us 10 years but we made it.
10 hours ago, otkpantsdown 49 said:
but she refuses to understand
I found this statement interesting compared to the rest of what you say. Sounds like she is making an attempt from time to time and needs more time. I would encourage you to continue to communicate about it.
@no^angel well yes I had to define and assume basic Christian beliefs, and define it a certain way (the apostles creed is about as simple as you get in this case).
I would counter that you could make academic arguement and debate without holding a specific position yourself. One of the most interesting ways to study an arguement is to study and take a position you either disagree with or use assumptions that may challenge you. During much of the 12th to the 16th century this was alot of philosophy and done by some of the world's greatest thinkers.
On use of the word christian for everything does really bother me...as one and as somebody who like to define things. For the record...we don't consider what we do CDD. Although elements of my arguement above apply, not all of it is orientated to Christ...sometimes a spanking is just a spanking.
I have several thoughts on your comment. But only 2 I will respond to for now.
1. What specifically are the axioms you don't accept? While I defined terms I did not define assumptions and curious as to what you are referring to.
2. For the discussion on the definition of CDD I defined it the way I did because otherwise it is not CDD. I agree most couples are practing DD and just happend to be Christian. But to apply the adjective "christian" to DD it has to be part of it. I do see a gap in the venacular here...and why I spent time defining CDD up front.
For the people who use CCD I see three groups:
1. Those who use CDD to assert the man as HOH in all or most areas using a biblical justification. I object to this becuase of the premise it has to be a man...and is not explicitly biblical.
2. Those I described above and I do recognize it is not most. But I was asked for a justification and not what most people do.
3. Those as you describe who add the label to what strictly would be defined as DD...they just happend to be Christian. I would just call this DD. If they were not Christian they would like practice anyway. Which I don't see an issue with. Within marriage and consenual, safe, and sane...not my business. Just don't call it CDD, it is just DD. Part of this may come from guilt of "it is a sin" so they look for justification. I would argue that it is not sin, it is just being open to your spouse argued your particular dynamic. So no biblical justification is needed.
I don't have time now but I spent most of my life baptist...but made my rounds. I found myself pulled to the catholic theology because of its completeness and consistant nature. Somthing not always found in baptist circles.
Before we could talk about it, we had to learn how to talk. This was an overall change for us in a lot of respects. We dug up how we react to things based on childhood experiences, how others interacted, differant cultures (country boy and a city girl), etc. It was really eye opening.
Alot of the advice above was what not to do. A piece of advice I always give is...become a servant...not a slave. If there are jobs around the house she hates...do them for her. If she really likes something that you loath to do...do it. Really make her the prioirty...show her evidence you are changing for the good. This gets me out of the dog house all the time and convinced my wife this was more than just some weird fetish.
Thank you for the kind words.
I picked the title like I did for a reason. Most of life is a journey. We all change all grow in many ways. Then you turn it into "our journey" when you get a spouse. It takes work and being deliberate about it.
I am considering the next two entries being something like "the top things to do/not do to get your spouse on board". I will biased to my experiences but the comments section will allow others to concur...not concur.
If anybody has thoughts I am listening.
30 minutes ago, CHJ52417 said:
I’m so impressed you’ve learned to communicate about this so well. It’s so difficult.
It is an acquired an practiced skill...along with couples therapy/counseling. It was not overnight and natural. The first 10 years of marriage it did not exist...and we are still working through it. But thank you...we have worked hard at it.
It came up because it was tied into part of the reason we were there. Which I may cover in a future post but that is deeply personal. The counselor stayed very neutral except to say that if it was done in a consensual and healthy manner it could be something to discuss. But we spent enough time working on communication and issues from our individual pasts that this really became a secondary item.
For the book. I would preface it with this. My wife was put off by the tone in that it assumes a woman should want to spank and it is fun. For my wife that never is the case. She does it for me not for her. I would also recommend you printing it out and highlighting in it. Green = This statement is me, Yellow = Maybe/Maybe not, Red = Hell not that is not what I think or want to do. This allows it to be a way to speak to her and communicate without having to come up with the words yourself. It covers a wide area and could be a great tool but take it slow so it does not confuse. Know it yourself first.
Vanalia in this sense yes. She would not be doing this at all if I had not asked...and even then takes lots of discussion, reading, education...etc. All of that is still playing out to this day.
Upon Request - A discussion of CDD and "Christianity"
in Our Journey
A blog by Somthingrandom in General
Thank you for the kind words. Feel free to PM me if you have questions or want to dog deeper, ever situation has nuance. Be careful and find balance. But most of all stay true to your faith.